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Living with Stage Four Small Cell Lung Cancer, living with untreated small cell lung cancer, lung cancer support group

Marv as Grandpa Seven Years Ago
I feel alone as the spouse of someone living with Stage IV small cell lung cancer who has chosen not to seek treatment. I’ve found no one in the exact same boat of uncertainty, so I have no one with whom to share my anxiety of when our “untreated” situation will change and what that change will look like.
Instead, I’ve submerged myself in the online places where persons live who are undergoing treatment for this same cancer. I’ve read countless stories about treatments, side effects, deteriorations, and deaths, as well as remissions, though seemingly temporary, and hope. And I’ve felt surrounded in those stories by a huge dose of love and support and encouragement for each other’s situations.
I remember when I required my nursing students to attend a support group of their choice during their mental health nursing practicum. I went to a few open meetings myself and remember feeling like I wanted to have my own “issue,” because I loved the unconditional support I felt in those meetings among the participants and wanted to be able to attend in a capacity other than as “the nursing students’ teacher.”
So, I think about What if? What if I had a support group with spouses in my exact situation? What would that look like?
For one thing, I’d want lengthy conversations about why their spouses chose not to seek treatment and how their introduction into the world of cancer progressed. How did they find out they had cancer? What were their symptoms? Or was their lung cancer discovered by default like my husbands was? Then, what doctors have they seen? Internist as gatekeeper? Pulmonologist for definitive diagnosis? Surgeon for biopsy? Oncologist to hear options? And who else along the way?
And what did they hear from each one. Did they hear “a few weeks to a few months,” “very aggressive,” or “you must start treatment right away”?
Or did those doctors start out with, “What are your priorities? What’s most important to you now?”
In my informal conversations with folks who have lived through other types of cancers, I ask how their doctor visits went. To a person, they went like ours. All health care workers, from receptionists to nurses to doctors, have assumed we were there to seek treatment. Thus a “before” photo was taken when I wanted to ask “before what?” Schedules for chemo were laid out before Marv said as nicely as he could to either hold their spiel or make it quick because he wasn’t going to take treatment anyway.
No one’s first question was: “What are your priorities? What’s most important to you now?”
In my reading, I find this approach is called the medicalization of illness in later life. We older people are not allowed to die naturally because, historically, doctors are taught to treat and cure, so the health care system revolves around that philosophy. And most of us still don’t question our doctors and follow, rather blindly, whatever they say we must do.
I’d heard about Atul Gawande’s Being Mortal before Marv got cancer but was happy someone reminded me of it (a whopper of God’s grace) and I was able to finish it the night before we met with the oncologist, the last doctor we saw in our medical parade.
Gawande argues that doctors could use a different approach. He paraphrases Susan Block, a palliative care specialist: “There is no single way to take people with terminal illness through the process, but there are some rules…. You sit down. You make time. You’re not determining if they want treatment X versus treatment Y. You’re trying to learn what’s most important to them under the circumstances—so that you can provide information and advice on the approach that gives them their best chance of achieving it. The process requires as much listening as talking. If you are talking more than half the time, you’re talking too much.” (p. 182)
“You’re trying to learn what’s most important to them…”
We did not feel that concern or hear that question in our medical parade, except from Marv’s internist on our first visit. He asked what our winter plans were. We said we were traveling to Arizona, and he said, “Go ahead. Do what you want to do.” He expedited biopsy of an external nodule, so it could be done before our impending trip.
After that we did not hear that concern or encouragement again until our first hospice visit. Now every week, she asks our plans, commends our activities, and makes sure we feel equipped to do whatever we want to do.
It’s very comforting to have her on our page. And I can only hope whenever people face a cancer diagnosis, they do not immediately panic, but instead seek out a doctor who asks, first, about their priorities. Someone who asks, “What is most important to you?” before the receptionist takes their picture or the nurse presents a schedule.
And, now, would you believe just a few hours ago, I found a person online whose loved one was just diagnosed with Stage IV small cell lung cancer and they’ve found out it is too advanced for any treatment and have been referred to hospice. I was able to reach out in support of hospice as a comforting measure and with an expression of prayer, and I’ve heard back.
I believe I’ve found a “support group” after all. And a niche where I can support others with small cell lung cancer when treatment is not possible and dying naturally becomes their unchosen way of life.
And just when I was wondering when God’s Grace would step in on my “feel alone” concern…
I also loved the book Being Mortal. It was so right on. We had a discussion group on it with many of our associates attending. They encouraged the associate to read it. Prayers for you and Marv as you go through this journey of cancer. I can see a future book on it to help others in a similar situation.
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Good to hear of your discussion! Encouraging. So many don’t want to talk about dying. Thanks!
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I’d want you in my support group should I ever need/want one!!
Marv is blessed to have you by his side through all of this.
We’ve experienced saying a final goodbye to two close friends since our visit w/ you. Their dying pathway was very different and validated for me the choice you two have made.
Thanks for the continued update. We love you both!
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Oh, Sandy, how sad. I guess, realistically, this is what we must face at our age. I’d love to be in a support group with you, but not for this reason! Maybe a laughter support group! We love you folks too.
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Jon was an in client at the hospice for the last ten days and I cant sing the praises of all the staff members without feeling the love they shared. Remember that you have all the support you need at this time from your family, your friends and your visitor. With love from far away.
.
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Marv is so impressed when I tell him about you, Judith. To think someone across the world shares in our story is truly a blessing. I appreciate hearing about Jon. Not sure I told you, but we spelled the name of our son just like his. No h. Thank you!
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Ahhhh, listening. Such a simple, caring thing to do. The Lord is giving you wonderful insight. Marv and you are blessing many as they read this. You are in our thoughts and prayers!
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Thanks, Lois. As fellow nurses, we know the importance of listening. And I’m finding it provides reciprocal healing moments.
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Health care providers want to cure, a pity that more have not read Being Mortal so they start with a discussion of priorities. Your chronicles are a support to all in the situation Marv and you face. If you were in Chicago, you could find support at Gilda’s Club. They were invaluable to me when John Lamb and I were dealing with his terminal brain cancer.
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Oh yes, and there was a place in Hinsdale too. When I read all the stories of folks taking treatment, I’m so thankful Marv opted out. When the oncologist said treatment would buy him so little extra time, that was it. Marv wanted the quality of life he was used to and so far, nearly five months later, he does. I can appreciate your accounts of John L’s cancer so much more now.
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I sure hated it when I felt I was facing a difficult, uncertain future alone.So happy you found someone who understands – and are articulate and intelligent enough to help us walk along with you even though we have to do it mostly a step behind and as learners. I was so impressed with Being Mortal and it shaped my perspective of living and dying although I know I will still have to make decisions based on kind of cancer and when caught. He also wrote a book about senior living centers that was equally life changing for me.
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Thanks for mentioning Gawande’s other book. I’ll have to put it on my reading list. He makes so much sense. This “whether or not to seek treatment” is such an individual decision with many variables. There is no one-size-fits-all category. I’m lucky to have Marv to help me process all these feelings too.
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Jim and I talk about dying frequently and I have come to the conclusion that the one being left has the hardest work to do in processing what it all means.
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I think so too. I’m the one who goes on alone, and I won’t have Marv then to process with me. And it’s work you can’t really do with your children as they will have there own kind of grief.
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Yes. Hugs.
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I’m following with great interest, Lois. Glad you’ve found someone who understands. I have a friend who chose no surgery/chemo/radiation and went her own way with alternative treatments for breast cancer, and came out cancer-free. Lots of her friends and family thought she was foolish, but I didn’t. She’s been an inspiration for me.
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Thanks for that inspiration! It’s refreshing to hear about people who make informed personal choices. I’m happy it worked out for your friend. Thanks!
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